Let’s Normalize Caring For Your Pelvic Floor
Episode 12: Let’s Normalize Caring For Your Pelvic Floor with Sara Reardon of @the.vagina.whisperer
Disclaimer: This episode is for entertainment and educational purposes only and does not constitute medical advice. Please seek immediate care from your physician if you have any concerns about your health.
Join Rachael and Dr. Sara Reardon as they talk about pelvic floor care before, during and after pregnancy. Dr. Sara Reardon is a mom of 2 and a board-certified pelvic floor physical therapist who has worked with thousands of women for over sixteen years to heal and care for their pelvic floor. SO many of us struggle with pelvic floor issues and are either not receiving the proper care and attention or feel too embarrassed to even seek out help. Dr. Sara Reardon aims to be a support and create a space where we can get the care we deserve! In this episode we discuss:
what is the pelvic floor?
the importance of pelvic floor therapy before and after childbirth and postpartum recovery
what to keep in mind for intimacy and exercise postpartum and when Dr. Sara recommends resuming sex and working out
taking care of your C-section scar
birth and how it affects your pelvic floor
what Sara wishes she knew before having kids
Dr. Sara Reardon is a board-certified pelvic floor physical therapist, wife and mom of 2. Her instagram page, The Vagina Whisperer, is a go-to resource for taking care of your pelvic floor before, during, and after pregnancy. Since 2006, she has worked with thousands of women suffering from pelvic floor problems which inspired her work on The Vagina Whisperer. She created and launched a V-Hive Membership which is an online, on-demand pelvic floor fitness program, just three 10-minute workouts a week with minimal equipment. Her website has tons of free resources, such as the Pelvic floor guide as well as options for booking 1-1 telehealth appointments with pelvic floor therapists.
COTERIE 20% off all diapering products (diapers, wipes, pant) with a minimum spend of $40 for new customers on one-time OR subscription with code NOONETOLDUS at checkout!
Rachael is a mom of 3, founder of Hey, Sleepy Baby, and the host of this podcast.
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Welcome to No One Told Us, the podcast that tells the truth about parenting and talks about all the stuff you wish you knew before having kids. I'm your host, Rachel Shepard Ohta, and today I'm so excited to talk with Dr. Sara Reardon. And Dr. Sara is a board-certified pelvic floor therapist, wife, and mom of two. And her Instagram page, The Vagina Whisperer, is a go-to resource for taking care of your pelvic floor before, during, and after pregnancy. Sara, thank you so much for joining us. I would love if you would just start with telling us a little bit about you and your backgrounds and what led you to become The Vagina Whisperer, which is a huge title.
Sara: Thank you. So I, as you've just already kind of shared, I'm a pelvic floor physical therapist. I've been a pelvic floor PT for 17 years. It's all that I've done after graduate school. And I really specialized in pelvic health right out of grad school because I loved working with this patient population. I thought it was fascinating to understand more about my own body,but then also work with people who I just kept hearing over and over, like, why didn't anybody tell me about this sooner? Or I wish I would have known about this sooner. And it just impacts their quality of life in such a positive way. And so I just fell in love with the patients. And then I have two kiddos, a six and an eight year old. And when I was going through my own pregnancies, I just was like, gosh, I know all of this information. And I feel like everybody should know this. I don't think that it should just be like, hey, I was lucky enough to pick this field and I'm privy to it. So that's how I started the vagina whisper Instagram page, which has grown just so much over the past six years and led to like my online exercise platform for pregnancy and postpartum and just really in an effort to make these exercises and this information more accessible and just normalize the conversation.
Rachael: I love that. And it's so unfortunate because I know I have a pretty international audience on my Instagram page. I don't know about you, but I always hear them talk about it in such a way that they're like shocked that we don't have this as standard care in the US where other countries are getting like six weeks of free pelvic floor therapy after they have a baby. It's so crazy.
Sara: It is and I think there's such a spectrum and I really think that after kind of looking at where we are, I think the US is really in the middle. So there are a lot of European nations that their whole support system for parents and mothers is just completely different. I think pelvic floor physical therapy postpartum that's government paid for is one aspect but everything from parental leave to kind of work like balance and childcare access. But then there are other countries where people are like, I don't, there are no doctors or physical therapists here and I can't even talk about my vagina and my pelvic floor 'cause there's nobody who to even go to. And so I think that we do fall somewhere in the middle and I do see the needle moving. I think over the past five years, social media has really helped provide a platform to have more of these conversations like you and I are having and just increase awareness that like, oh, there is this specialized therapy that can help moms after giving birth or even prevent issues during pregnancy.
Rachael: Yeah, I think that what you just said about like normalizing and I know you say this, let's normalize the conversation but not normalize the problem, which I love so much because I will never forget. I was maybe seven or eight months postpartum after my first baby, I decided, okay, I wanna get back into exercising. I'm gonna go for a run. I peed my entire self, like I had pee just dripping down my legs. I completely wet my pants and it was so embarrassing. I was in the park and I had to come home and I told my husband like, I didn't even have to pee. Like I didn't even feel like I had to pee, it just was coming. And then I remember another time, I thought maybe that was a one -off. Another time I went to a kickboxing class, I couldn't do a jumping jack without peeing. And I feel like you hear these jokes where it's like, oh, you know, I've had three kids. I can't laugh anymore without wearing a diaper. You hear all of these like little jokes and it normalizes it, but not in a great way because parents and moms don't realize that like maybe it shouldn't be happening.
Sara: Right. And I think it's, you know, I think what's helpful, the jokes, and they help us bring levity to what can feel like a heavy kind of embarrassing topic. And so I think that there is something positive about that. But I think a lot of the messaging over the years has been, oh, now that you're a mom, this is just your new body. This is just normal for mom. But then it's like, but there's no solution. And that was offered. And now I'm like, there is a solution and it may not get you completely dry, but I think it can at least help you feel empowered and like less fearful that either you're gonna make it worse or that you can't do the things that you wanna do. And I just, it's so interesting because there's so much focus on really important things postpartum like mental health or breastfeeding and lactation. And I'm like, your pelvic floor is affected by these things and these things affect your pelvic floor. So, you know, with breastfeeding and lactation, there's a change in your pelvic floor because your estrogen levels are changing and that can cause discomfort within your course or a higher risk of leakage. Or,you know, even with mental health, I'm like, they're like, oh, go exercise. I'm like, people can't kickbox, they can't run. So the things that help them feel like themselves or help with their stress or anxiety are not accessible to them anymore. And we're missing that whole piece that helps them do the things that they wanna do. And so, again, I think it is just kind of just normalizing, talking about these things, which is awesome. And, you know, why I feel so fortunate to have this conversation with you and your community, but not just be like, oh yeah, they're normal, kind of just deal with it. 'Cause then we do all end up in diapers and I don't want that to be my destiny, you know?
Rachael: That could not be my normal. I refuse to wear a diaper at 34 if I don't have to. And I love what you said about how it's just all connected, right? It's all related and to do the things that we wanna do and that make us feel like we're taking care of ourselves, ourselves. Like, you're right, the pelvic floor has everything to do with that. And I also talked to a lot of moms who might,you know, not all of us are ready for sex like immediately or even within a few months. And I think that's fine to normalize too. But what about, you know, the people who want to get back to that relationship with their partner and it hurts, and it feels really different. And pelvic floor therapy can help a lot with that too, right?
Sara: Totally. And you know, the research is really showing that nine out of 10 moms have pain with sex the first time they have sex after giving birth. And I'm like, nobody tells you that nobody's like, Hey, this can happen. And these are some of the things that you can do. Use a lubricant, take some deep breaths, make sure that you're healed, like that your, you know, perineal tears healed or that you, you know, your your abdominal incision isn't causing you discomfort. Like, it's just like thumbs up, get back to it. And then you start feeling like something's wrong with you, because nobody warned you, hey, these are things can happen. That can happen. These are things to help. And if that isn't better, still after those things, I'm like, maybe check in with the PT. And, you know, I saw a mom who was 11 months postpartum, and she was just like, I can't have sex. It's so painful. I saw her three times, and it was 100 % resolved. And she's just like, I suffered for 10 months. And I just felt like I was broken and literally within like a couple sessions, I just feel like, like happy, but also frustrated that I dealt with this for so long, because nobody told me that there was an option for help.And so I think we just everything from painful sex to urinary leakage to cesarean scar restriction, like people can't have their babies lay on their bellies or they can't,you know, wear their babies or they can't have their baby lay on their tummy and they can't wear jeans. So it's just things that we don't think about that feel small, but they really do affect someone in such a big way.
Rachael: Do you find that most moms are ready at six months or six weeks? I'm sorry. Do you find that most moms are ready at six weeks or, you know, do you think that that's it varies for like exercise and sex and all the things that we're supposed to be able to get back to at just six weeks postpartum?
Sara: Totally. I mean, I don't know who came up with that number. Like where is it? It wasn't a mom, you know.
Rachael: It was not a mom. It was not a mom. It was a man.
Sara: Exactly. So, I mean, I will say I didn't get back to having sex after my second kiddo until I was 12 weeks postpartum. And it wasn't even because I was like, oh, am I ready? I'm like, I can't even function right now. Like I'm still... It's the last thing on your mind. I'm just trying to brush my teeth once a day, like let alone get busy, you know, and like we're sleeping in separate rooms and I'm up on that with the baby. So, I think it's, we just need a little bit, we need a free pass to do what we need to do without the additional pressure of exercise and sex, which I have no idea why those are the two things we focus on at six weeks because I feel like it's the last thing a lot of people worry about. I would say that it totally depends. There are some moms that I see at four weeks, they're like, I feel really ready for sex and I feel like I could get back to the gym. I think what's important is to take it slow in the sense of if you're going back to working out, you really want to focus on rehabilitating your core, working on your pelvic floor because you went through a 10 month pregnancy and then childbirth. And so, four weeks is just like, okay, you might just be not bleeding by then and you still have a lot of rehab to re -strengthen and recover. I would say that most people I usually say, like, when you feel ready, try to go back and eight to 12 weeks is a little bit more reasonable time for like, make sure your stitches are healed, give it a try, you know, use these tips for sex, use these tips for exercise. And if it's uncomfortable, like, don't push through, that's a sign that your body might need a little bit more one -on -one support.
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Rachael: So you mentioned that after this like long pregnancy and birth and everything that you know there are so many reasons why we might have a weaker pelvic floor and need some help or some therapy do you find that even for moms who didn't give birth vaginally who had a C -section that they really benefit from pelvic floor therapy as well like it doesn't just have to do with the type of birth you had I'm assuming.
Sara: Right totally so I mean pregnancy itself changes your body and that really sometimes can have a more dramatic effect than even birth because your ligaments are stretching your pelvic floor is lengthening your abdominal wall is lengthening and so there are so many changes during pregnancy that regardless of regardless of what method you birth you're likely going to have like need pelvic floor and core rehab and then 33% of moms are giving birth in the US birth through C-section and there are so many things like after any surgery, I mean after like a knee surgery, a shoulder surgery, you go see a physical therapist to help rehab and so it's the same thing for a cesarean section with respect to working on your scar which I think for a lot of C -section moms can feel very emotional and scary and actually working on your scar can be very healing and it can help decrease pain, improve bladder function, improve bowel function, all of those things. So I think that's an important piece. And then also just working on core recovery. I mean, it's really hard to reconnect with this part of your body. So I feel like it's really important that you take those steps to be able to do that. So regardless of what method of birth, whether, and even if it was six years ago, 20 years ago, like we still see moms after cesarean birth and can do a lot of work to help them.
Rachael: Amazing. And so when you say like work on their scar, what does that actually mean?
Sara: I know, it's so interesting. So we do a lot of what's called scar mobilization or scar massage. When scar tissue heals, it kind of gets a little bit stickier and it doesn't move the way that pre -surgical tissue moves. Like it doesn't glide and move. And so what happens is that tissue can get really stuck. And so we do a lot of massage above, below and on the scar so that the tissue can start to move a little bit more freely. So it takes almost a year for those new tissues to kind of lay down. And so as your abdominal wall is healing, we want to make sure that tissue is moving really freely so it doesn't get stuck. Scar restriction can lead to pain, abdominal pain. It can lead to incomplete bladder emptying, constipation, painful sex because your abdominal wall fascia connects to your pelvic floor. And so we want to make sure that that tissue is moving really freely to minimize any of those things.And then also I really suggest using silicone on scar. So there are these silicone scar strips that you can put on. You have to wait until your scar is completely healed like there's no scabbing or sutures, but that can help soften the scar so that it's less red, moves a little bit freer. And it's something that people do after other surgeries. And so I definitely recommend that.
Rachael: Cool. And so is that something that people can do by themselves? themselves, like to themselves, or is that something that you always need help from a therapist to do?
Sara: No, you can totally do it on your own. And I think most people after having a C-section are scared to touch their scar. It feels like, how much pressure should I put on it? Am I gonna hurt myself? So I do think it's helpful to have some support and guidance through that process. I have a whole kind of postpartum recovery series in my membership that kind of walks people through like, hey, if this is your scar, like this is how deeply you can press. These are the different motions that you can make on that scar. If your scar is healed and you're like eight to 12 weeks post -surgically, like it's okay to work around it. And then after 12 weeks, you can work directly on it, but you're not gonna injure yourself. It just feels kind of scary and it is. So if that feels like you, it's totally fine to get one-on-one support.
Rachael: Okay, that's great to know. And there's something else that I wanted to ask you because I will make a confession. I've never gotten pelvic floor therapy.
Sara: Okay, you're not alone.
Rachael: I really know that I could benefit from it, but, and I've talked with friends about this, too, like I wasn't even aware of it with my first kid, but after my second, or I guess right before my second, I was kind of like, oh, well, there's no point 'cause I'm just gonna get pregnant again anyway. And then, you know, I'll have to start the process over again. And I think a lot of people kind of feel that way, like, oh, there's no point to like get back in shape now or work on my pelvic floor now 'cause I'm gonna just have more kids. So is it beneficial to start before pregnancy, during pregnancy, or does it really not matter until after the baby's born?
Sara: I'm like all of the above, Rachael. I mean, in my ideal world, you would work with a pelvic floor PT during pregnancy. I always say it's like pregnancy is, you know, preparing for, you're training for a race. You're training for a marathon. You wouldn't just go into birth without training. You wouldn't go run a marathon without training. So why are moms giving birth without working towards that? And because your body goes through so many changes, like urinary incontinence and prolapse. So, you know, all these things can start occurring during pregnancy, you know, hip pain, low back pain. And there are things that you can do to help. So during pregnancy, I think it's awesome in the ideal world, but then definitely for birth preparation. So in your third trimester, working on like how to push during childbirth, how to breathe, how to recover after a C-section. Like there's a lot of things that you can proactively do to help set yourself up for success. And then I would say, if you were just having a baby, six weeks postpartum is a great time to check in, right after you see your doctor or midwife, because you've kind of gotten clear for any medical stuff and like, hey, let's start working on rehab. But it can be, you know, a long time later. I do think that there's a benefit seeing a PT between pregnancies. And the reason is because you wanna be in the best possible shape going through that experience. Like if you're gonna run another race, like you kind of wanna train for the other race. You don't wanna be like, oh, I ran a marathon two years ago, let me just try another one again, you know? So there's a lot of benefits to restrengthening your core and pelvic floor to minimize how much damage or how many changes will happen during that. And I think a lot of people, they don't always have the first birth that they want. There's a lot that we don't know. And so I think it's really empowering for them to feel more prepared going into a future birth.
Rachael: That's so true. And I think a lot of us also just have been raised in this culture to like be ashamed of our body and to really not learn enough about our body. And so all of that, I think ties into this like kind of shame and embarrassment also with trying to see somebody for this.
Sara: Yeah, and just to not prioritize ourselves. I mean, we are prioritizing raising kiddos and that takes up the majority of our time and energy. And so you're not alone in feeling like, where does this even fit in? Like, again, I'm still trying to just shower and brush my teeth every day. We often put ourselves at the bottom of that list of priorities. And I think some of this is just to be like, hey, I matter the way that I feel, the way that I function is important. And oftentimes we always feel like, you've gotta put the mask on the parent before we can take care of the kid, But we don't we don't do that in our daily lives and I struggle with that as well.
Rachael: Me too.
Sara: So I think once you do come up for air I think it's really important to be able to prioritize yourself because this is a long game we're thinking about. This is, you know, we have a long time that we want to keep functioning and our body will continue to change and our hormones will change So the more that you can do now, I think the better you can set yourself up for success in the long run.
Rachael: I think that makes a lot of sense and that's kind of what I'm guilty of is like it always seems like Just another thing on the to-do list another thing I have to fit in I have to find childcare while I'm at the appointment like all of that stuff just feels like so much and so Just never do it, but I am done having kids now and I definitely think that It's something I want to explore more because it sounds like it would be so beneficial for so many reasons. For people who maybe don't live near a pelvic floor therapist or who just really truly do not have the time or the Capacity or the resources or the support to go see someone One -on -one in person.What are some things that they can do to just help support and strengthen their pelvic floor? Maybe at home?
Sara: So there are so many things and I think that they're kind of what you were talking about like it's hard to get to an appointment Or I mean, I think there's so many more resources now. I think that there are virtual physical therapy sessions that a lot of people do. We have kiddos come into our clinic everywhere. I mean whether six weeks old or six years old like we have kids come in all the time and they either like We have our front-office person hold the baby or a kiddo sits in the waiting room and does the iPad or whatever. So I think most of these clinics are pretty welcoming to moms and parents and because we know that it is a challenge And then I think there's a lot of online programs, as well like I know I started, you know my V-Hive membership because it was like what can we do to help people who can't make it to physical therapy, who can't afford it, who don't have access to it, who don't have transportation or just who don't have time? I said, there's some online platforms where you can just do a little 10 minute workout and it walks you through, how do I do a pelvic floor contraction? Where do I start? Do I start strengthening? Do I start relaxation? So just a lot more options for people nowadays.
Rachael: That's awesome. That's so good to know because yeah, like you said, there's just so many things to consider when, especially for moms that are like brand new. I remember after my first and even after my second and third, like taking a baby out of the house or multiple kids out of the house or getting them ready for a sitter or whatever is just like so daunting sometimes. But like you said before, like you're worth it.
Sara: Yeah, it's still daunting. I mean my kids are six and eight and I have a friend who was traveling to Ireland and she's like, I'm going to Ireland, I'm not gonna lie, I'm kind of scared with her baby. And I was like, I don't like going to Costco with my kids Like that still stresses me out.
Rachael: You still have to get in the right mindset for that. I know.
Sara: But I'm still like shuttling them into the car. And so it's like, you know, that these are all normal experiences. And I think a lot of it is like finding what works for you. Sometimes people want to get out of their house and going to a class is like what works for them. And sometimes people are like, I just don't have access to that. Like what can I do from home? So again, there's a lot more resources now than I think there used to be.
Rachael: For sure. Are there any exercises postpartum that you would not necessarily recommend for moms that have had trouble with their pelvic floor? Like are there certain things that you would recommend or stay away from as far as exercise?
Sara: Yeah, that's a great question. So I really think that the first, the fourth trimester should really be on rebuilding your pelvic floor and core strength. So regardless of what you were doing during pregnancy or pre -pregnancy, I really think you wanna think about this like you were rebuilding the foundation of your house and your foundation is your pelvic floor and core. We always talk about core, core, core, but your pelvic floor is at the base of your abdominal cavity and that supports all of your pelvic organs. And when you're standing or running or jumping, like all of that pressure is going on your pelvic floor and that has to be able to support those activities. So really that fourth trimester, I'm like walk, do some strengthening, gentle strengthening and then after the 12 week mark is really when I'm like, okay, now you can try to do some high impact stuff like running, jumping, hit workouts, crossfit workouts, but you're taking it slower. You're not going back to where you were pre -pregnancy. You're starting at lower on the level of intensity. So maybe dropping your weight, dropping your number of reps, just doing lower impact stuff until you can build up that strength to get back to where you were. So I really encourage waiting until 12 weeks postpartum to get back to any high impact workouts.
Rachael: Okay, perfect. And can you just, I realized that at the beginning of the episode, we didn't even necessarily define what the pelvic floor is. So for anybody that doesn't know, maybe we should get back to basics for just a quick second and talk about what is even the pelvic floor.
Sara: That's a great question. So the pelvic floor is a basket of muscles that sit at the base of your pelvis. It sits like a hammock and attaches just from the tailbone in the back to the pubic bone in the front and kind of slings side to side. In that hammock of muscles are your reproductive and pelvic organs. So your bladder which holds urine, your rectum which holds poop, your ovaries, your uterus, growing baby during pregnancy. So that hammock supports all of those organs. And during pregnancy as your baby is growing, that hammock is lengthened and stretches out because it's supporting more weight. And so that's why often you'll experience pelvic floor issues like leakage or heaviness or prolapse during pregnancy itself. The pelvic floor also has the openings to your urethra where urine exits, the anus where poop exits and then the vaginal opening for vaginal intercourse, menstruation and vaginal birth. So that's why it plays a role in all of these different functions and seasons of our life where I mean everything from sex to peeing to pooping to birth, it's like there's a role of the pelvic floor and all of those things. And it changes over the course of life, but during pregnancy and birth, I think it goes through pretty huge transformation.
Rachael: For sure. And so since you mentioned it is supporting so much weight and so many different organs, does it matter how big your baby is? Because like there are some moms who have a five or six pound little peanut baby, and then there are other moms who have like a 10, 11 pound baby. So does it make a difference how big your baby is?
Sara: So, you know, I would say up to about 10 pounds, it's not, the research is showing that most people have, are not at a higher risk for any issues. Once you get over, I think it's like a nine and a half to 10 pound baby, like their babies considered like larger birth weight. And those moms are at a greater risk for certain things like pelvic organ prolapse or urinary leakage. However, the more births you have, you're at a higher risk, there are doing higher impact exercises like running, jumping, crossfit, you know, things like that are our risk factor. And then also genetics, you know, if you have a mother or an aunt or a grandmother who had prolapse or weakness, that's also a risk factor. So there are some things that are in our control and some things that are out of our control.I do however think that there's this thing about measuring baby's birth weight and they're like, you're going to have a big baby. Those measurements can be completely off. You can be within a pound to a panel and a half off. And so you're thinking, I need to get induced at 38 weeks because they say I have a nine pound baby. When that is not necessarily the case at all. And again, unless you have a giant baby over 10 pounds, it may not make a difference for you. So I think there's more focus that needs to be put on how we birth, birthing in different positions, movement during birth. When people are getting the epidural, how long they're pushing, a lot of those things really can have a result in pelvic floor function after birth.
Rachael: Oh, interesting. Yeah, because I think it makes sense when you think about how some people are instructed to push before they feel the urge to push in and all of that must make a difference, right?
Sara: Right. I mean, how long you're pushing? So pushing over two hours. So if you want to labor down or you're not ready to push, that makes a difference if you're pushing and straining your muscles. If you are holding your breath while you're pushing, for some people that technique works fine, for others, holding your breath makes it actually harder to push effectively. Ultimately, during birth, your pelvic floor does not push your baby out. Your uterus contracting pushes your baby out. Your pelvic floor just needs to get out of the way. Think of it like a tunnel and we're just trying to like help lengthen the pelvic floor so that the muscles move out of the way and the baby can come down the birth canal. So exhaling as you're breathing and being in a different position, maybe sometimes on your side or in hands and knees can help facilitate that versus just lying on your back. Yeah. I definitely think there are other things that we can do to facilitate preserving the pelvic floor as well.
Rachael: That's so true. Those images you see on TV of moms giving birth on their back, it's like, I had my first, I was pushing, like you said, I was pushing for like two and a half hours and eventually the only way he came out was I was like in happy baby pose and like on my side with my knees way up and then my second…I gave birth on hands and knees and it was a million times easier. Slid right out.
Sara: That's incredible. Amazing. I know and I think that we just, it's not that this is like side lying is the right way or on your back, I think we just want to give people options, right? This is the only way that it can be done because that's not true. I think it's just the way it's been done for a long time, but we would hope that medicine has improved over the past 30 years.
Rachael: You would hope. I know. You can only hope. Sara, thank you so much for joining us. I have one last question for you, which is something that I try to remember to ask everybody that comes on the podcast, which is what is something that you feel like no one told you before you had a kid or before you had your second baby or just before you became a mom in general? What's something that you wish people would talk about more? It could be pelvic floor related or not.
Sara: It's not pelvic floor related. There's three things, but I'll keep them short. I think- one- that breastfeeding is hard. I had only seen moms kind of pop the baby on the boob and it looked really easy and natural and it was not the case for me. I had a really difficult time. No one also told me that once you're done breastfeeding, or lactating, that you can have a lot of anxiety, like your hormones have completely changed. And I thought I was going totally crazy after I finished breastfeeding. And my friends were like, oh no, that's like normal, like anxiety is normal. And I was like, well, nobody told me, you know? And then I think honestly, the biggest one is the effect that having kids would have on my marriage or my relationship. It just was completely out of the blue. I mean, we really struggled that first year after having our kids. And I think that looking back, it wasn't like we would have done things totally different. I think I just would have known like, okay, this is temporary, this is a season we're both kind of falling apart right now. And just been a little bit more mindful and prepared for that shift versus thinking like, oh my gosh, we're getting a divorce. We're never gonna make it because it is temporary, but I just was completely blown away and I felt like something was wrong with us. But I think it's more normal than we realize.
Rachael: Oh my gosh, I can relate to that so much. I could do a whole episode just on that. And I probably will at some point because yeah, I think that is again, such a common experience that nobody really wants to talk about 'cause they feel like it must say something bad about their marriage or their relationship or their partner to feel that way.
Sara: But it also feels really lonely when you think you're the only one going through, but I think more people go through it than we realize.
Rachael: Absolutely, how could they not? If they say that they're not, they're lying.
Sara: I know! Don't follow those people.
Rachael: Yeah, exactly. Thank you so much, Sarah. Where can people find you and all of your amazing resources for pelvic floor health?
Sara: So I am on Instagram as the Vagina Whisper. I'm on TikTok as the Vag Whisper. TikTok doesn't like the word vagina. But then my website is thevaginawhisper.com. I've got tons of blog posts and like free downloads on birth and pregnancy and strengthening. And yeah, thank you so much for having me. I'm just super thrilled to be able to share this information. I am so happy to be that people are going to hear your wisdom too.
Rachael: This is such an important topic. So thank you so much for coming on and have a great rest of your day. Thank you!
