Stay At Home Dad Life

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Rachael: Welcome back to the pod to my husband, Marley. Your first episode was so popular, so I think people are going to be really excited to hear from you again and this time under a little bit of a different context. So Marley is joining us today and he is fresh off what, one and a half weeks as I stay at home?
Marley: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. crushing it. Days under your belt crushing it.
Rachael: So I shared on stories a couple days ago, or yesterday, I don't even know what fricking day it is, we're just coming off of bedtime and like we're completely wrecked. Amen. I keep thinking it's a day ahead. Anyways, I shared at some point this week that you just passed your licensure exam for what is the actual title?
title? I'm sorry.
Marley: I'm a licensed clinical social worker now.
Rachael: Okay, got it. So this is something that you've been working towards since Otto was literally a baby when you finished your graduate program and you've been working towards your hours ever since, finally all culminated with this huge test that you've been studying for and you passed, which was so exciting. So now basically you're gonna be, I mean, you're gonna be a stay -at -home dad still, we'll get to that. But now, with this license, you could do therapy essentially, right? Like, would it be talk therapy? What type of therapy would you be able to do with clients?
Marley:Yeah, I could do, I could open my own private practice. The license allows me to diagnose, it allows me to supervise and sign off on hours for other social workers who are trying to get their license. It opens up a wide variety. of things. But yeah, it would be mostly talk therapy if I were to go that route.
Rachael: I mean, judging by some of the responses I got on Instagram, lots of people are calling for some type of dad's mental health, like gentle, respectful parenting, some type of dad resource dad account. They feel like they're the ones doing all the work,
doing all this research on parenting, trying to break those generational cycles, do things a little differently. And they feel like I'm speaking for the moms here that they're kind of having to play catch up with their husbands to get them kind of on the same page and educate them and share all these resources. So just going to put it out there. I mean, I don't selfishly. I don't really want you to.
Marley: I am I am privately having these conversations with lots of my friends that are dads and moms to really stuff with something that's on my mind. mind and, you know, mental health in general is on my mind, but particularly how it plays out for myself and other people in this, this stage of life when you're trying to balance so much. I'm thinking about it. I'm thinking about it.
Rachael: Yeah. All right. I mean, I have mixed feelings just because I, I have seen and you have seen because of me, the ugly side of social media and how it can take a toll on your mental health and that, that part of it is definitely, hard And I think would be even harder for you because you are more sensitive than me You don't you don't have quite as thick of a skin. No, not that anybody would hate on you But I mean,
it's the internet, people are kind of brutal.
Marley: Yeah, people would and I would I would Probably feel some kind of way about it and I'm aware of that and I'm it's nothing to be ashamed of I'm happy that I'm a sensitive person. Yeah, I feel the good and the bad.
Rachael: I mean, I think like I said I think it's it's so needed and maybe we'll figure out a way to make it work in a way that works for our family someday. But selfishly, I know also how much time it takes, right? I've been doing this for four years now while also caring for our kids. And so selfishly, I don't really want you to 'cause then I know that it'll take a lot of time away from me and the kids. And that's not what we signed up for right now.
Marley: To be clear, It sounds like you're soft launching a thing that is like not, that is nowhere near even being in the work.
Rachael: Well, no, not necessarily… I just, I think that we should just keep the conversation open. Maybe this podcast is a little bit of kind of like an entry, maybe, I don't know if people resonate with this episode, the last episode you did, maybe we could start to do more episodes and kind of start to bring the dads into the... fold here. Because I think they do need so much help. I mean, dads really do struggle with mental health postpartum too.
Marley: And it's even less normalized for them to seek out support or to talk to friends about it or just the community that you've cultivated seeing all the messages that you receive about like the impact that you're able to have on other people. I mean, that's, that is a very enticing component of entering this space. Because certainly in my my previous job, it's nice to make individual difference, but if you can do that on a broader scale, larger scale, then
Rachael: Yeah, it would be a huge scale.
Marley: It would. I'm all about helping people.
Rachael: I know you are. Well, maybe someday. But for now, you're gonna be helping our kids and you're gonna be helping me.

Marley: They are people and they need help.
Rachael: They are people, of course. They need lots of help some days. So let's talk about this kind of transition that we're going through right now. now with you leaving your job, becoming a stay -at -home dad. Lots of people have questions about it. It's something that's still not super duper common. Like we don't really know any families. We might know one or two where the dads have like taken a sabbatical or something like that, but we don't really know a ton of people even here in San Francisco where it's a stay -at -home dad situation. I mean, I didn't even really know any stay -at -home moms. At the park it was always like me and all the time, the nannies and the grandmas, like there's really not a lot of stay -at -home parents here at all. So yeah, it's just a thing that's less normalized. I think it's really cool So people are curious about it. So my first question for you would just be like what we've been talking about this being a possibility for a long time. It's been more of like a pipe dream and I'd say in the last year or so it became kind of okay Maybe we actually could swing this for a little bit but for you what was it? it that seemed appealing or what was it that made you say like okay yeah I want to do this or I could do this. Y
Marley: You know in thinking about it I think that realistically there were three reasons that led to this decision and I guess I'll put them in order of importance and the first thing is I just want to spend more time with our kids and I may regret saying that, I may regret that month and then you can retract that statement if you want to. I've never, I only ever hear people say to just grasp this moment in time, try to save for every moment because it goes so fast. I mean, it's such a stereotypical thing to hear from people. And I know that to be true.
I mean, we have a six year old now and it just feels like he grew up so quickly. And I really do want to be present for these kids. I don't really want my mind to be elsewhere. I want this time I've never heard anybody say like oh really savor these are early years in your career Like they're gonna be the thing we look back on so fondly like that's not the case. At least in my field in my profession.
Rachael: So well, I was gonna say your line of work… Like I don't know anybody that would be Savoring any piece of that. Do you want to just tell people so they have like an image?
Marley: I will get that Actually was okay my My second reason was to give you more time to do what you need to do. I mean, realistically, you have been sacrificing for this family. You have built this hey, sleepy baby community and business. No exaggeration with a child attached to you or in you for the last literally three years. It's been really remarkable
Rachael: It will be four in March.
Marley: I know, that's nuts. I really wanted to be a supportive partner and for me that looked like getting you all of the support that you needed. As I mentioned before like it seems like you are making a really big impact for a lot of people. And so if I could be a support to you and doing that then I would absolutely love to because I think that you can really shineWe . So right and I think you can really do big things. And I told you that before you started Hey Sleepy Baby.
So just for all of you out there who are like, oh, he's probably just gassing her up because she says, well, no, no, I told Rachel before this started, one of us was going to blow up and do big things and put in the work and have the idea that she really had the entrepreneurial spirit in the vision.
And I was 100 % correct, which is also, you know, why I decided to marry you. But that's the last you did say that last reason is sort of the push. I mean, that the family in you, that was the pull. And the push was just that I was very aware of my burnout in my current position. I worked for City of San Francisco on a team working with people with severe mental illness who were refusing treatment, but are cycling in and out of jails or hospitals. So people who are really, really really in a bad place because of the nature of them refusing treatment, it was just a lot.
And I was in the tenderloin, that's where my office was. So we were, you know, I'm sure if you've seen anything, if you know anything about San Francisco. If you know the Bay ar, if you've seen any documentaries about San Francisco. Or if you've seen any of the sensationalized photos of like the homeless crisis in, I put it that in the air quotes, in San Francisco. I mean, it is a crisis. But yeah, it was sort of where the heaviest stuff is going on. And so I was there before the pandemic.
Rachael: You have to keep confidentiality, obviously, but like some of the stories you would come home with and tell me about were just absolutely insane. You were bearing witness to just... There were certain things you couldn't even tell me.
Marley: Yeah, it was just, it was, there was so much despair. And so I realized that I think especially in the pandemic that I just couldn't balance my attention appropriately,
like I had to come home and be so present for these kids and give them my best. And I just wasn't able to, I thought, when I was younger, that I would be able to just care more and I would just take in more.
But I realized that I just had a finite amount of bandwidth.
Rachael: But part of it is that you do care so much. And like you internalized everything that you saw and everything. that your clients went through.
Marley: Yeah, I mean that was hard to shut that off. Yeah, it was hard to shut that off. But that I was feeling burnt out at the job and I was aware enough to recognize that I wasn't as committed or as invested enough as those clients deserved. And that was because really my attention in my mind was with my family. And if I was going to preserve any sense of myself. to be the best version of myself, that was really giving it to my family. And some people can find the balance. I found that I was struggling to do so, especially after the pandemic and sort of in the midst of what the system is going through. And so, yeah, that was a good motivation to capitalize on this opportunity so that I could spend more time with the family and allow you to do your thing.
Rachael: You're a typical cancer. You just want to be where your family is. You just want to be home. And I'm so happy that you are. Like I said, this has been something that we've been like kind of dreaming about for a long time. Really didn't ever think it would be a possibility. But even if it's just short term for the next couple of years until like Leni's in school or something, and we maybe don't need a parent home full time, or you feel like you really have the itch to get back into the field, like even just having a year, a couple years, whatever it ends up being, will be such a blessing for these kids to have more of you around and will be a blessing for me to have some time to like breathe. I don't think people realize how much work this business is and I think, you know, they see me posting on Instagram and they're like, Oh, that looks so easy. And like, I get why people think that because that is the easy part of the job. Like that is something that I love to do. And it's so fun.
And that's really like where my passion is is connecting with real people on social media. But there's so much more that goes on behind the scenes, especially now with like, adding new projects like this podcast, or, you know, there's some other really exciting things happening soon, that are going to be a shit ton of work that I'm excited to do, but that I would have never had the time or space to do if we hadn't made this. shift. And we also would like to travel more and just spend more time with family. And so I'm just really, really excited for this next chapter.
What some people want to know is I think, like I said, the idea of like a stay at home dad, especially one with three kids is not something that's like super, super common. And I think a lot of people can't wrap their head around it because I was getting a lot of questions about like like, how does he feel taking the kids out by himself or how are you guys going to split the load or those kinds of like logistical questions. So I mean, you're a champ at taking the kids out, but I know that you didn't always feel super confident with having them by yourself. So how do you kind of feel about that now and what tips would you give to maybe a dad or, you know, the non -primary parent or caregiver? what are some tips to kind of gain that confidence with really getting your kids out and about? 'Cause staying home is not an option.
Marley: Staying home is the worst thing you could do, trust me. The worst thing you could do. I would just preface this answer by saying that I was 100 % there. I used to be super nervous. I didn't know if I was gonna have the right things.
I get super bent out of shape when the kids are whining or crying in public. public. I just some. Yeah, you get so flustered. Internalized sets of shame about like being a bad parent or something. I can't be the only one that experiences that. But I think now I feel very comfortable with it. Um, I mean, this is my third time around. I'm somewhat seasoned.
Rachael: It does.
Marley: I think that would be the advice that I would give to the non mom parent. It's just. just get your repetitions in with anything. All you gotta do is get out there, learn from your mistakes. Did you forget to bring an outfit and the kid had a blowout? Did you bring the wrong kind of snack? Do you need to bring water? What are the things? And for me, I just learned through experience. And so if anything, I bring everything that could possibly go wrong. And then I'm also just... just not that hard on myself. Like, this is not a make or break situation. You're gonna have these kids every day. And sometimes it's gonna go great and sometimes it isn't.
And sometimes, you know, 50 % of the day is gonna be great and then 50 % they're gonna melt down. You have really no control over that. Like, there's so many unforeseen things that are gonna happen. You know, just about your kids. kids mood or how rested they are, their nutrition or maybe they had an experience at school that you don't know about and they're not talking about. You know something that can just impact the overall dynamic and so is like if you're so concerned that it's not going to go well that you're not doing it at all like that's the real shame.
Rachael: And I think so many of the dads or other parents out there might be worried because what I see a lot especially as the mom is like, these babies want us, they're attached to us, they go through periods of, you know, like a real mommy phase or separation anxiety or things like that. And so that can feel really like rejecting for the other parent. And so I do see a lot of, you know, the dad may be pulling away a little bit and saying, okay, well, I'm just not going to try then because they don't want me or, or things like that. So how do you kind of push through those moments?
'Cause our kids have definitely gone through mommy stages.
Marley: Yeah, they go through mommy stages and I still feel some kind of way when that happens. Like it's only natural to have something you love or reject you for somebody else. And I found pretty early on that in the absence of you, actually being alone with them when you're not around was the opportunity to see. see how much they really enjoyed being connected to me and how much they enjoyed spending time with me.
And so the other piece of advice I would get is try and go about it on your own. You'll learn so much about yourself as a caregiver, you'll be forced to learn so many more things. One of the most frustrating things as a stay at home parent or even before all that was me trying to assume responsibility for all of the kids While you're still around because if you're around like they don't care who we think is in charge. If you're there, they're gonna they're gonna decide who they want to listen to and who they're gonna pursue and so Yeah, you know you and I have like a rule or it's like you gotta beat it Like you have to be out of sight. They have to believe That you are gone
Rachael: That's why I have my little she -shed.
Marley: Absolutely. And they don't even know you're back there most of the time. They think that you go on more walks than any woman in history.
Rachael: I know. They think I'm training for a marathon.
Marley: They might grow up and think that you're like a secret smoker because you went on so many walks.
Rachael: Oh my god. Yeah. My mom would just disappear for walks for like three hours at a time. I know. But they can't know I'm back here or else they will come back here. I mean sometimes they they come looking for me, Noe will be like knocking a window, but for the most part if they if it's like out of sight out of mind.
Marley: Yeah, but I would say you got to get out of your comfort zone. Babies are gonna push you in a lot of places and so you got to lean into it for sure.
Rachael: And it's best for the baby too for them to have those experiences of being soothed by Dad or at the other caregiver or whoever it is because if they don't ever
have those experiences they're going to have a hard time with it. So they have to just have that practice. What would you say you're the most excited for, for this like new journey, new chapter, stay at home dad life? What are you looking forward to the most?
Marley: Hopefully being proactive with doing stuff with the kids, like, I don't know, getting them into some extracurricular or, you know, taking the initiative to try and do more like science -based play things or just something. I felt like... in this previous dynamic we had set up, I was just like surviving, right? Like I would come home from work. It was immediately dinner, bath, bedtime. You know, the weekends are pretty jam -packed with birthday parties and other stuff. 'Cause I didn't feel like I really got to have any control over sort of like the things that we were gonna do or just following their lead,
everything. All the time seems so structured. And so I think what I'm looking forward to the most of what we're going to be doing in the future. just having more time that doesn't feel so jam packed with with plans and kind of just to see where things go.

Rachael: That'll be really nice. Yeah, we should just acknowledge that this is like a huge, huge privilege that you're getting to stay home. And I'm sure it's gonna be filled with, you know, things that are hard. But overall, like, we're just so, so lucky that this is an option for us right now. And we're so thankful for it.
Marley: Yeah, I mean, the choice to be able to leave my work is certainly something I never thought that I would ever have the option do. So this is certainly like uncharted territories. I hadn't even really let my mind wander to what this sort of life could look like. I mean, I'm realizing pretty early on that I'm going to have to be very intentional with it and sort of treat it like a job.

Rachael: You see these like mommy wars? online all the time about like, it's a privilege to stay home. No, it's a privilege to work or, you know, and really the privilege is just to have that choice and that option is a huge privilege, right? So.
Marley: Yeah, totally.
Rachael: All right, well, we will keep everybody updated on the dad account thing, but for now, it's just gonna be stay at home, dad Marley. And maybe we'll get you to come on Hey, Sleepy Baby and do like a day in the life some days so people can kind of see what you're up to how you're managing like Lei's nap schedule and all that kind of stuff. And thank you so much for recording with me tonight, post -bath time and post -bed time.
Marley: Yeah, post -bed time. It's kind of like the only time we get to have a conversation. Is this the best version of ourselves?
Rachael: I don't know. I don't know. But honestly, like it's more talking than we usually do after bedtime. Usually we're like in our bed scrolling. TikTok or I'm watching housewives or snacking or something. So actually it was really -
Marley: You and your girls.
Rachael: I know it was really nice to actually sit and talk with you after bedtime tonight. So thanks, Honey.
Marley: You're welcome. I love you.

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